---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: George Luk
Date: 2015-06-27 19:03 GMT+08:00
Subject: 給特區的信（１６３）－朋友傳來關於「甩轆」事件的網上討論
To: "Mr. Li Wei" <drc@drc.gov.cn>, "Mr. C Y Leung" <ceo@ceo.gov.hk>
Cc: "hd@1823.gov.hk" <hd@1823.gov.hk>, "Mr. Anthony Cheung" <sthoffice@thb.gov.hk>, George1 Luk
李偉先生／梁振英先生：
1. 以下是朋友傳來關於「甩轆」及近期的另三則事件的「
2. 其實過去近廿年時間，中央及特區政府，對泛民及建制內的「
3. 為着日後的合作，非常同意無必要「捉鬼」，
4. 經此「否決政改及之前的佔領行動」一役，
（A） WhatsApp對話 揭建制甩轆亂指揮 --連結（太陽報 – 2015年6月25日星期四上午6:02
（1a）Cletus • 2天6小時前
Have anyone seen or heard that discussions with various ideas that are fully planned and organized?
Have you ever come across any of your conversation and discussions that are well organized and planned?
You talk, he talks. You suggest, she suggests.... are these being normal in our daily activities?
Have you ever come across any of your conversation and discussions that are well organized and planned?
You talk, he talks. You suggest, she suggests.... are these being normal in our daily activities?
（1b）And what makes WhatsApp contain all conversations between members? What are being stolen here are only part of the discussions between members. Base on conversation here and there, how can this reporter interpret what are actually going on? Only these few conversation scripts become all conversations, verbal and mobile... ?
（1c）This report intentionally mislead readers into believing that 建制派內部訊息極度混亂，Picking messages here and there is of course appear 混亂
（1d）Did they pick up WhatsApp conversation between 泛民? No? Why not?
Are they spying against 建制派? Sure, they are.
Have they violated privacy? Yes they have.
Should people use WhatsApp for political conversation, absolutely not. Use Blackberry!
Are they spying against 建制派? Sure, they are.
Have they violated privacy? Yes they have.
Should people use WhatsApp for political conversation, absolutely not. Use Blackberry!
Are these reporter and editor(s) being Idiot! Looks like it.
毒報
（2）Lavis • 2天5小時前
群組唔係一對一, 當然可以見晒所有對話
（3）YiYi • 2天5小時前
東方 with "Very biased reporting"? Sorry I can't stop laughing !
（4）Sandyrosyblue • 2天４小時前
Every news report is biased. It is naïve to assume news report are not biased. The political naïve HongKongese are fooled by the biased media in Hong Kong all these years.
（5）YiYi • 2天4小時前
Yea, agree with Sandy. Using a news report with very biased reporting as a point is really naive.
（6）Lawrence • 2天4小時前
東方 with "Very biased reporting" .... True, becos they are 建制報
（7a）Cletus •2天4小時前
Read the news. Watch the news from various channels as many as we can; keeping in mind that we cannot trust totally on all these news reports. Refrain from making conclusions too early.
（7b）In this case, even if the report is true, it does not mean it is a total collapse of their communication, because it is discussion among many members, each of them of course has his or her own opinion. It is NORMAL! The problem is not in discussions on how to make the best of the situation to make the political reform went through.
（７c）The problems lies on their execution. And the problem of execution also lies on the fact that （某某等） intentionally did not co-operate,
It is foolish to use insecure WhatsApp. It is also foolish to trust（某君）. It is indeed foolish for politicians not to have any security in mind.
（7d）We all should realize that politics is 臭坑. And 臭坑出臭草。 Many politicians become 臭草 when they are in that environment for long. And of course some are born 臭草, who like to stay in 臭坑. The environment lead them to become self-serving. They have to play tricks. They have to use all means to win, because winning is everything in politics.（7e）Now, with this understanding, and with the understanding that the livelihood issues（民生議題？） in Hong Kong are the most important for the prosperity future of this region, should we insist a very loose general election for the job of Chief of HKSAR? The demand from pan-democrats in Hong Kong is both unrealistic and damaging. The form of democracy they demand is the worst form of democracy that no country on earth is using it..
（7b）In this case, even if the report is true, it does not mean it is a total collapse of their communication, because it is discussion among many members, each of them of course has his or her own opinion. It is NORMAL! The problem is not in discussions on how to make the best of the situation to make the political reform went through.
（７c）The problems lies on their execution. And the problem of execution also lies on the fact that （某某等） intentionally did not co-operate,
It is foolish to use insecure WhatsApp. It is also foolish to trust（某君）. It is indeed foolish for politicians not to have any security in mind.
（7d）We all should realize that politics is 臭坑. And 臭坑出臭草。 Many politicians become 臭草 when they are in that environment for long. And of course some are born 臭草, who like to stay in 臭坑. The environment lead them to become self-serving. They have to play tricks. They have to use all means to win, because winning is everything in politics.（7e）Now, with this understanding, and with the understanding that the livelihood issues（民生議題？） in Hong Kong are the most important for the prosperity future of this region, should we insist a very loose general election for the job of Chief of HKSAR? The demand from pan-democrats in Hong Kong is both unrealistic and damaging. The form of democracy they demand is the worst form of democracy that no country on earth is using it..
（8）YiYi • 1天23小時前
I get your point, China is the best.
（9）WhiteKnight • 1天18小時前
rubbish English！洋奴！
（10）Kwan • 1天9小時前
Although what Cletus said is a little weird, I get where he's coming from. And it is true that news are very biased here, but very few keep in mind that. I am still happy to see like Cletus around. No comment on your other points. As for WhiteKnight... how do you call someone 洋奴 when half of what you just wrote is in English, even your name...We have too many people like this on yahoo..
（11）Newbarn • 1天9小時前
放煙霧彈最叻。
（12）Cletus • 13小時前
If one really wants to discuss, raise the point that you do not agree. Then we can improve from discussion.
"rubbish English", "洋奴", are nasty words that shows you are out of reasons, that you have to resort to name calling.
I would like to see which point you do not agree in my original comment in here.
"rubbish English", "洋奴", are nasty words that shows you are out of reasons, that you have to resort to name calling.
I would like to see which point you do not agree in my original comment in here.
（13）Kwan • 11小時前
Yea, I agree, again, these ppl are here for fights not for discussions..
As for your last point, it is not like I disagree with you but heres my thoughts:
Are they spying against 建制派? Sure, they are. - so what conclusion can you make from this?
Have they violated privacy? Yes they have. - Uh, its not like you're wrong, but yea blame the govt for they have committed no crime.
Should people use WhatsApp for political conversation, absolutely not. Use Blackberry! - For a second I thought you were comparing an app with a phone haha.
Are they spying against 建制派? Sure, they are. - so what conclusion can you make from this?
Have they violated privacy? Yes they have. - Uh, its not like you're wrong, but yea blame the govt for they have committed no crime.
Should people use WhatsApp for political conversation, absolutely not. Use Blackberry! - For a second I thought you were comparing an app with a phone haha.
（B）公民黨愈來愈激 骨幹紛跳船 --連結（太陽報 – 2015年6月23日星期
（1）Cletus • 3天前
It is indeed heart broken when one realizes that the dream that one has invested so much effort on, finally get broken for good.
If this is indeed his dream: a moderate democratic party that can communicate with Chinese government for the people of Hong Kong, he deserve lots of respect.
If this is indeed his dream: a moderate democratic party that can communicate with Chinese government for the people of Hong Kong, he deserve lots of respect.
（2）Eddie • 2天9小時前
Let us wait and see how much he will be able to accomplish in the coming future.
（3）Patrick • 1天2小時前
Unfortunately, given the unforgiving nature of the Chinese Communist Party, Tong's action and stance would only be seen as a collaborationist or defeatist.
（4）Cletus • 14小時前
Is this only your view, not a view from Chinese government？ Should you assume others not as intellectual as you are？
（C）羅范斥「荒謬絕倫」 --連結（太陽報 – 2015年
（1a）Cletus • 1天3小時前
A group of straight forward politicians should not try to play tricky games. They want to try whatever they know of to get the bill through. But they are not that kind of people. The intention is good. But the execution is terrible.
Be yourself, you are on the right track, Why should you push things beyond your limit. You at least are the ones who can differentiate good from bad. much better than your political rivals who know nothing but against everything from Governments.（1b）Those compatriots who criticize you openly are not better than you are. Partners are supposed to support each other, helping others when making mistakes.（1c）Remorse no more. Keep low profile and continue to work hard and do your jobs. People have short memory. They will get tired and bored to continue laying blames on you. This is not forgotten only if you try to fight and defend continuously. Yes, mistakes were made. And who on earth do not make mistakes. Your work in the coming months will prove that you are good members in the legislature.
Be yourself, you are on the right track, Why should you push things beyond your limit. You at least are the ones who can differentiate good from bad. much better than your political rivals who know nothing but against everything from Governments.（1b）Those compatriots who criticize you openly are not better than you are. Partners are supposed to support each other, helping others when making mistakes.（1c）Remorse no more. Keep low profile and continue to work hard and do your jobs. People have short memory. They will get tired and bored to continue laying blames on you. This is not forgotten only if you try to fight and defend continuously. Yes, mistakes were made. And who on earth do not make mistakes. Your work in the coming months will prove that you are good members in the legislature.
（D）田北辰指有人披露建制派短訊群組內容事件嚴重 --連結
（1a）Cletus • 1天10小時前
A lesson to be learnt. The political world is very dirty. The consequence for individual participant can also be very serious.（1b）When we talk about general election for government major posts without screening, one person one vote for nomination, and for selection, we are talking about letting a dirty world to develop and to evolve into an authority group without control. We are talking about the enlarged risks of having destructive elements to govern our region.（1c）It is not a matter of democracy anymore.
Regards,
George Luk
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日期： 2015年6月27日 上午10:45
主旨： 給特區的信（１６２）－香港可成中國崛起推手：荷英美模式 (檔
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給特區的信（１６２）－香港可成中國崛起推手：荷英美模式 (檔
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